Together with members of your group and students in other sections, you’ll be reading The Bookseller of Kabul over the next several weeks. Although you're not required to take notes while you read, it would be wise to keep track of important events and characters for your own clarification. You are, however, expected to participate regularly and thoughtfully in an online discussion of seven essential questions.
Here's how it works:
Divide your book into two roughly equal halves. You need to have read and blogged about your book by the due dates below.
- There are two kinds of posts in this discussion: responses and comments.
- Post at least SIX responses altogether: at least THREE for the 1st half of reading and at least THREE for the 2nd half.
- You must respond to at least five essential questions over the course of your reading.
- You may respond to only two questions more than once.
- One of your six responses can be a "free response" post.
- Post at at least TEN comments altogether: at least FIVE for the 1st half of reading and at least FIVE for the 2nd half.
- Post your first three responses to the book and five comments by TUESDAY, MARCH 15.
- Post your final three responses to the book and five comments by THURSDAY, MARCH 31.
- How do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society?
- Where do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives?
- How are the characters affected by events/changes in society?
- How is the practice of veiling (or restrictions on dress in general) reflective of cultural attitudes toward gender roles? How do these attitudes affect characters’ lives?
- How does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
- How do the characters’ personal stories expand your understanding of the societies in which they live?
- Should there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not?
Assessment: To earn maximum credit, post thoughtful responses that are at least a short paragraph in length—and carefully proofread! Do not misspell characters' or authors’ names! Also, be sure to include specific references to the text (either details or short quotations).
Where do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society?
ReplyDeleteThe characters in "The Bookseller Of Kabul", mostly the women, express their individuality mostly when they are home and with family. The women at home are able to converse with each other and wear some of the clothes that they prefer. At some points the author even talks about makeup, where they are in the market and put on the lipstick they are breaking some rules, but it is okay because their burkas will hide it. Throughout chapter 8 the author calls the women "burkas" instead of calling them by name. The women who are shopping can find each other in the crowds of people by their shoes and by the ways that they walk. She even mentions that Shakila flirts with the way that she walks, even though she is wearing a burka.
I believe it's human nature to want to express yourself. In more repressive countries where that's frowned upon, people still find a way. Sultan expresses himself with his love for literature although he is not so desperate for an outlet because he's a man.
DeleteAll the characters and people who live in such repressive societies live in fear when expressing themselves. Sultan risks his life each time he sells a book and women risk their honor and the honor of their family whenever they present themselves differently than the strict societal norms.
DeleteHow is the practice of veiling (or restrictions on dress in general) reflective of cultural attitudes toward gender roles? How do these attitudes affect characters' lives?
ReplyDeleteThe women in the society are required to wear burkas, which cover every part of their body besides the eyes. This is reflective of the male authority over women and how the men look down on the women. Women even in their homes are required to dress heavily whereas men are required to follow a much lighter dress code. The women in the house are under the men, and are forced into marriages, like Shakila into her marriage and Sonya into hers.
The practice of veiling seems to be a physical way to show male dominance in the society. The female characters are completely stripped of their own dreams when their entire life is planned out by men. It's heartbreaking.
DeleteThe practice of veiling gives the women no power. The society strips women of their freedom of wearing not even what they choose, but making them wear something so repressive. The veil is almost like a symbol of their life as a whole, society just wants to show which gender is "boss."
DeleteHow do the characters' personal stories expand your understanding of the societies in which they live?
ReplyDeleteThe characters' personal stories, like Sharifa's story in being the first wife to a husband with two, add a lot to understanding the places that they live. Sharifa was very upset when Sultan married another woman, even though it was his right to do so. After reading her story it seems that the society in Kabul isn't fully polygamist, but allows polygamist ideology, even though (as it seems) it is generally frowned upon. Also the story of Saliqa who broke the rule and met alone with a boy. She was essentially shunned from her family and could no longer find any suitors because she had responded to a boys affections. From her story you can see that an unmarried woman expressing love to people outside of her family is very wrong and not good for her or her family's reputation.
The stories collectively show the lack of love in Afghani society. In fact the text even comes out and says that love is not taken into account when marriages are arranged. Our idea of loving your significant other is completely disregarded in their society.
DeleteThe book shows us that not only is love not taken into consideration when a Women is married off to a Man but that Men seem to only be married to these Women to use them for their own purposes that they don't want to do themselves. I can't believe that Women have no say at all in who they get married too and I wonder how America would be different today if that occurred in the United States. Also I wonder if the families of these young Women really love them because they find it very easy to bargain their daughters off to the Man who gives them the most in return.
DeleteThe men don't really get to feel love either. At least not in a natural way. The marriages are essentially business deals. The man is almost just as unconsidered as the women. The main difference is that the man can choose his woman, even if she's in his 50's and her in her teens...
DeleteSince love is subordinated to status in Afghani marriage arrangements, it would seem to be absent in most marriages. Yet we know that love exists between Sultan and Sharifa, and some couples learn to like, if not love, each other. In any case, we might conclude that domestic stability is more highly valued in this culture than romantic love.
DeleteIt's seems as neither gender really gets to show their feeling for one another till after marriage, and even then you might've married the wrong person. Love is not essentially a choice rather than a business, the more money you have the more choices you have. Then maybe a person can find someone they feel affectionate towards, but it seems marriages are based on how well the wife can provide for what the man wants and how wealthy the male is.
DeleteHow are the characters affected by events/changes in society?
ReplyDeleteThe characters in The Bookseller of Kabul are effected significantly by changes in society, specifically those caused by the changing of power in Afghanistan. Zahir Shah's rule is often brought up as one of the better times in Afghanistan, especially for women. Burkas were worn by the upper class as a way of preventing the lower classes from seeing a woman's beauty. This remained until the next ruler, Prince Daoud, convinced the upper classes of doing away with them. After this, they would become a staple of the lower class. Finally, the burka became a required piece of clothing for all women going outdoors when the Taliban established control over Afghanistan. Unfortunately for women, even when the Taliban were ousted, this requirement remained in Afghanistan's society. The burka's role in society wasn't the only thing that effected characters, however, as Sultan Khan's bookstore was heavily effected by the changing powers. While under Zahir Shah, he was able to run his bookstore the way he saw fit, selling books that represented many viewpoints and cultures. Under Prince Daoud, who sought help from the USSR, who then brought in communism in exchange for said help, Sultan Khan was restricted in not only what he could sell, but how he could sell. He wasn't allowed to sell books that went against communism or supported the Mujahideen, and his way of selling books was accused of being capitalistic. Then when the Taliban showed up, he wasn't allowed to sell books with pictures or living things in them. Unlike the situation with burkas, however, this was reversed once the Taliban lost control of Afghanistan.
I like how much detail you put into this. You stuck to the big changes like coups. There isn't much to say other than you could also mention changes within the families themselves. It seems that the community is very close and small changes like marriage seem to throw everyone off, mostly effecting the bride's family because she moves out. The author even mentions that it's as if the family mourns the loss of the girl even though she is only across the town.
DeletePeople often forget to mention the fact that men are forced to grow big, full beards and are often required to wear turbans under Taliban rule. It's mentioned while Sultan is walking the treacherous path between Pakistan and Afghanistan that he's taking a risk by wearing a fez instead of a turban. Plus, beard growing really isn't for everybody, especially when you live in a hot dry desert. Can you imagine how hot and itchy that would be?
DeleteThat;s a good point to bring up, Cyrus. You're right that sometimes the men and their dress codes do get skimmed over. I think it is easy to do that, especially when we're specifically asking you about women in the novels. Thanks for bringing attention to the men as well and how they are even oppressed by their government/society.
DeleteHow does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
ReplyDeleteOur culture's view of women and head coverings is, obviously, very different than those of Afghanistan. Gender equality, or at the very least the fight for it, has been in our culture for a long time, and has established the general agreement that men and women should be treated equally in society. This isn't the case in Afghanistan, where the culture is restrictive of the rights of women, particularly in marriage. Women are seen as a kind of tool, something that can give birth to kids and then raise them. Daughters are sold off to other families, and it's acceptable for an older man to marry a young girl to extents that would be outright illegal in the US. Sultan, for example, marries a 16-year old Sonya when he is in his 40s or 50s. Additionally, women have no say in their relationships. A man requests their hand in marriage, and the woman's parents decide if the man's offer for the girl is good enough, and if the man himself is good enough. Women are punished severely for breaking this tradition, as seen with the girl who was beaten for simply taking a taxi ride and going to the park with a boy from school, or the more extreme example of the woman who was killed by her brothers at the command of her mother for cheating on her husband. Then of course, there's the subject of veiling. Veiling is used as a means of control over women by men. With the exception of family members, it blocks off anyone except the husband of a woman from looking at her. Additionally, Shalika believes that the way in which the woman must look around, by moving their entire head within the veiling, is another means of control, as it allows their husband to see what they're looking at.
I agree that the women in this book are oppressed and are by many means controlled by the men. The U.S has had its times with women's rights, but I don't believe it's ever been so severe. They are in this case seen as tools, for the sole purpose of keeping the house, making the food, and raising many children. And everything seems to tie back to the burkas, the women are scared into wearing them, if they don't they will be severely beaten or killed.
DeleteThis is an example of what happens when a society literally lives by the book. In our country, though we are mostly christian, religion is not supposed to control us. That's why we have separation of church and state. In fact, that's why we left England in the first place. We wanted a place where we could practice the way we wanted to practice and now that can mean not practicing anything at all. While women are still expected to wear certain articles of clothing that men are not, we don't have such strict rules and I believe it is due to the fact that we do not live in a theocracy.
DeleteHow do the characters’ personal stories expand your understanding of the societies in which they live?
ReplyDeleteBy getting to read the personal stories of what amounts to the characters' day-to-day life teaches me the implications of the rules of their society, rather than the rules themselves. The Middle East and Islam being as hot a topic as it is today, it's hard to not at least have a small amount of knowledge on the societies there. However, we don't usually get stories such as "The Bookseller of Kabul" where we get to see one of these societies at work. To give an example, I was aware of the fact that young women were often married off to older men, but I wasn't aware of the way in which marriage worked. I didn't know about the lengthy negotiations, ceremonies, and traditions that lead up to the marriage itself. I was also somewhat surprised at the nature of burkas in Afghani society. I was first surprised at how they were uncommon before the Taliban, and then again when society kept them as a requirement for women after the Taliban were out of power. Overall, "The Bookseller of Kabul" gives an explanation to the various factors of societies I'd already known about.
The personal stories seem to add an understanding of Afghan culture that I don't think would otherwise be there. I agree with what you have said, I had no idea how marriages worked and was very interested with the henna ritual and how the bride cannot be happy because she will upset her mother, but she cannot be sad because she will upset the mother-in-law. Also the foot thing that the couple did to distinguish the leader of the house, and what seemed like a car race at the end of the wedding were very intriguing. I guess we don't live in a very good area to experience many different cultures at work.
DeleteAside from an Afghan writing a book about Afghan culture, this is probably the closest look we could get into the lives of those living in the country. The woman is Norwegian so she doesn't have the American grudge against Islam and particularly Afghanistan.
DeleteThis book not only has shown me what the Afghani culture is really like but the book really helps Americans like us to see what really goes on for different people in the repressive society. All we ever see about these places across the world is on the news and that creates stereotypes that everything is bad there and everything is war. This book helps show what is hidden by war on our news today.
DeleteGarrett,
DeleteYou make an excellent point about the value of reading books, fiction or nonfiction, to explore the human dimension of other cultures—especially those clouded by media-driven stereotypes, biases, current events, etc. There's so much more to any culture or place than what we hear on the news.
One thing this book has taught me is the unfortunate truths of Afgani culture. I'll be up front and say that the marriage system is broken. I knew that young women were married off to old men and this has just shown me how much worse it was that I had assumed. It's also done a great job of reinforcing stereotypes. The mention of the traditional poem wherein the woman dies from having sex with a donkey has really stuck with me. A slur for middle eastern people I hear sometimes is literally Goat F***ers. This is not really that far off. Plus Sultan "Chortles" every time he hears it. It's really a gross and honestly disturbing aspect of the culture that I thought was often exaggerated by Americans but, if this book is to be believed, we're not that far off.
ReplyDeleteI agree with everything you said and I also am very surprised about the truths this book shows us about the Afghani culture. I never knew how bad the marriage system was in their society until I started reading this book and I think it's horrible Women have to deal with this without being able to go against the issue. Also I was shocked when the book mentioned the poem about the gross story and I wonder why Sultan can laugh at such a terrible thing.
DeleteOur own marriage system used to be similar to this however not nearly as bad and fortunately its developed. Marriage is a business deal and both the men and women suffer emotional from this. I have serious wonders about the emotional wellbeing in both genders. Its a pretty traumatizing experience. Living in such a progressive society in the United States I cant begin to fathom that this is someone else's normal.
DeleteGiven our cultural experience, it's no wonder we're horrified by the gender inequity within an Afghani marriage. Sadie's point, however, references the history of marriage, which up until recently, was one of male dominance even in Western cultures. Patriarchal social structures reigned supreme for centuries, up until the 20th. I wonder if Western advances in women's rights have made traditional marriage structures, once the norm, seem unacceptable—even barbaric.
DeleteI agree the marriage situations in Afgani culture is down right awful. Until I read this book I had no idea that people were even allowed to be treated so wrongfully. The marrying off of young women to old men is just for wealth purposes, and if a man is wealthy he can basically get any women he wants. Families aren't necessarily guarding of their daughters, if the correct price is set the daughter will be married off. It is just awful.
DeleteI find it hard to visualize the people in the story. Sultan is, in my mind, Ben Kingsley with a fez hat and all the women are white, sometimes even blonde people. I have to actively remind myself that the women are wearing Burkhas and that they have darker skin. Perhaps that's related to how a western writer depicts a middle eastern family or it's just a representation of how little Americans in our part of the country are exposed to Islam and Islamic customs.
ReplyDeleteIt's good that you're aware of this and are actively attempting to make the changes in your mind. Are others experiencing this as well?
DeleteI didn't notice until I read this post that this entire book so far has been very difficult for me to picture in my mind. I not only am having trouble picturing the different characters and how they live but I also am having trouble imagine the way the culture around these characters looks like. Are the streets busy, or vacant? Im glad you pointed this out. It made me realize how difficult it is to picture people and a place different from the United States.
DeleteI can't say that I was imagining characters as looking like people I'd see on a regular day, but the way I imagine them, as well as everything else in the book, is certainly influenced by what I've seen elsewhere, mostly on the news or in movies and other media. While it's certainly a good thing to be able to get the image right in your head for context's sake, do you think it might actually be better to imagine them in a way that makes them appear more familiar to you? I think it could actually be a useful tool in allowing one to better connect with a character.
DeleteI can assume what the characters look like, but they would be based off of news articles or pictures provided of such cultures. Like the people on the front of the book, I assume that characters in the book look something like this. Facial features and the way their actions are portrayed can leave a hazy image in my mind, but the overall look of the characters in the story I can see.
DeleteSomething I've been surprised about throughout the book is not that women are repressed, but rather how they're repressed. When women are mistreated in the U.S. they're usually regarded as objects designed to entertain men or they're considered unfit for physical labor. It seems like the opposite in Afghani culture. The women are repressed but by being forced to wear clothes that cover their body. They're also expected to work in the house and do laborious things for the men.
ReplyDeleteWomen are treated differently in the Afghani culture by being forced to wear certain clothes and work but they also are treated like objects. The Women don't have a say in anything and once they are married off their husband tell them what they can do and what they can't. So I would say Women are repressed similarly and differently in the book compared to the U.S.
DeleteTo piggyback off of what Garret said, I agree that the difference lies in how they're viewed as objects, rather than whether they're objectified at all. In the US, when women do get objectified, it's usually, as you said, making them out to be sex objects or simply weaker than men. In Afghani culture, women are viewed as a sort of housekeeping object. A woman's place in her family is to keep the house in order, prepare meals, and to take care of her children and husband, not including any specific requests that her husband makes of her.
DeleteI wonder how the people in the society saw Seierstad living in Sultan's house. It's well documented that rumors can spread fast, especially among the women, so what stories were generated about her living with the family? Did they townspeople think that Sultan had gotten a new wife? I wonder if that will come up later in the book.
ReplyDeleteSeeing as Seierstad hasn't been mentioned by this point in the book, I wouldn't expect for her to enter it at this point, if only because the book focuses so much on Afghani culture and the lives of Afghani people that her inclusion could weaken that focus. As for rumors, I'd expect that as long as Seierstad respected Afghani customs while she was there, nothing truly harmful would come her way.
DeleteAll of the characters in the book assert their own individuality in different ways because of how everyone is repressed differently in the society they live in. The men in the society like Sultan are much more free to show their body and can express themselves in public. One thing Sultan can't do is express his individual thoughts and go against the societies beliefs. With women in the same society they are forced to wear certain clothes like the burka to cover their entire body and they only have a small opening for the women's eyes to show. The only time women can show their individuality is when they aren't in the public and are either alone or with their family in their house or backyard. I really am surprised how repressive the society is to the women that live their.
ReplyDeleteI can see the difficulties for Sultan not being able to express himself, as he is such a bookworm. I'm guessing keeping to themselves is a difficult task, but one they gotten used to over time. I wonder how many people would choose to stay in the "written way" of this society and how many would turn towards western cultures innovations?
DeleteBoth men and women are repressed in their society and are not allowed to show their individuality in public in certain ways. For the men they can show their body and dress how they want in public and at home but they cannot go against any of the societies beliefs or try and teach others different beliefs that may be better than the rules they already are living in. The only time Sultan can show what he truly believes in is at his home with his two wives and with his sons who work for him. For the Women they have much less freedom and are forced to wear the burka to cover their entire body in public. The women have no say with anything and their family chooses who marries them. The only time women are free to doing what they want is when they are alone and nobody is their to tell them what to do.
ReplyDeletePeople of this culture seem extremely selfless, putting their belief system above their own individual being. I admire it but I also question it. When this is all you know it must be hard to imagine that in other societies you can express yourself without fear of punishment.
DeleteI think the dedication to their belief system stems not only from a selflessness to their culture and traditions, but also from a fear of punishment. While women have to be afraid of literal physical punishment from their families if they break the rules, all Muslim have one common thing to fear, punishment from Allah. To give a bit of an anecdote, I was brought up Catholic, and had it hammered into me that if I was bad, and didn't follow the rules put out by the Bible, that I'd be sent to Hell. And even though I'm more of the skeptical side in terms of my beliefs now, the thought of going to Hell is still genuinely unsettling to me. One way I've heard it put that I think sums it up very well is that it's better to have followed the rules and have been wrong rather than to not follow them and actually end up getting punished.
DeleteWhen reading this book I was very surprised on how much Women are affected by changes in their lives like marriage. Women not being able to choose who they are married off to and not having a say in anything shocks me and makes me wonder how their society is successful with this way of life. How are Women ever happy if they don't have a say in anything they do? Women are married off once her parents get a good enough bargain from the opposing family and it shows how the Women in this society are treated like they aren't human. How can you truly love someone if you are bargaining to sell her off as a wife to another Man? Once Women are married they husband has all the say in what they do. Women can't work if their husband doesn't allow it and they also can't even visit their family without permission from her husband. I wonder if Women want to be married off?
ReplyDeleteIts as if the society is still in fear, even after the Taliban leave they are hesitant to disobey the rules. The men had always had power over women mainly because of tradition. In the book its frowned upon for the women to speak up for what they want when their families choose a suitor, so even if they don't like the man they will be marrying they're afraid to speak up. It is a very different way of life than what we are used to.
DeleteHow do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society.
ReplyDeleteSultan's character is fascinated by books and the knowledge they provide. He immerses himself in Afghan culture by reading history, art, poetry books, and novels. However, his society does not promote reading or the spread of knowledge. A special individual, Sultan goes against the grain of his society and sells all sorts of books to the Afghan people. In a place where individuality isn't celebrated, Sultan celebrates his knowledge and shares it with others through his book stores.
Far more repressed in the society are the women. They struggle on a daily basis to be respected let alone be seen as individuals. Islam culture does not encourage the mingling of unrelated men and women. In this story the daring Saliqa falls in love with a man outside of her family who she also wasn’t arranged to marry. Known among her fellow women, she is a bold individual despite her societal restrictions.
The characters in the book are constantly fighting against their fears when faced with their individuality. They are always deciding whether they want to be bold and be themselves or lay low and become just another person in Afghan society. There are so many rules that everyone must follow that in the end, almost everyone is the same. It must be hard to be yourself in a culture where people can so easily be invisible.
Delete
ReplyDeleteWhere do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society?
For Sultan, his individual expression occurs in his book stores. The women express themselves among each other often in private; at home with family. It is not socially acceptable for women to stand out public.
How does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practices of veiling (or wearing a headscarf) in other countries.
ReplyDeleteAmerican culture is twisted as it is very accepting of the exposure of women however these women are still harshly criticized. None the less, the individual expression of women is accepted and promoted. Through personal style, lifestyle, art, writing, and way of being, women and men alike are given the opportunity to invent themselves. Women over the course of history have been gaining rights bringing them more socially equal to men. With such free expression for women we perceive other countries as having negative views towards women. Some think these other countries over sexualize them by making them hide their ankles and wrists as they are seen a private areas while others think our own culture over sexualizes women by using half naked women to sell cars. Our own cultural views on women are not perfect, but women in our society are extremely fortunate to be allowed freedom to express themselves. Our views lead us to believe that the veiling and hiding of women, presenting them as inferior to men, is wrong.
You make a good point comparing the different ways women are sexualized in Western and Afghani culture. In both cases, the female body is objectified and defined by the male gaze.
DeleteWhere do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives?
ReplyDeleteI see Sultan as finding a source of inspiration in his life through books, his massive collection of books and business of making books keeps him happy with his life. When he arrives in Kabul he greets his first wife Sharifa and then goes straight to his books. Sharifa does get attention during Sultan's stay, but the books is what Sultan really seems passionate about. Sultan's life was made because of book selling. He was able to become wealthy, essentially getting him any woman he wanted. Without books Sultan's life might not have turned out as successfully as it did. Books are the inspiration behind Sultan's success and happiness.
I agree 100% with this. In the book Sultan almost seems to not care that he has his wives and if he didn't have books he would not be happy at all in his life. Instead of having his wives for love it is almost like he uses them to protect the other books he can't have in his store and his wives are like his employees. I wonder what really gives Sultan such an inspiration with books?
DeleteI think Sultan's obsession with books is fueled partly by his love for literature but mostly by a sense of cultural identity—and a dream of preserving the "Afghan soul" (22). He describes his dream on page 22: "When the Taliban were gone and a reliable government returned to Afghanistan, he promised himself that he would donate the complete book collection to the looted public library in town" so that the cultural heritage would be preserved.
DeleteHow is the practice of veiling (or restrictions on dress in general) reflective of cultural attitudes toward gender roles? How do these attitudes affect characters’ lives?
ReplyDeleteThe practice of veiling shows just how little power women have, as they are forced to wear the burkas. Some women actually prefer to wear the burkas rather than modern clothes in order to keep their faith, but others feel restricted. For example Shakila tells her future husband Wakil that if women start to wear modern clothes that she will follow. Wakil has the power to make her wear the burka, as men are able to control women to it seems like an extreme amount. Wakil tells Shakila that if she doesn't wear a burka it will make him unhappy, he attempts to tell her nicely that she will need to wear a burka. The gender roles are completely unfair, as men have almost all the power. The male characters seem to be unaffected, but the attitudes of women including Shakila are unhappy with the dressing and restrictions of gender roles.
In terms of Afghanistan, I think the last thing on the list of problems regarding gender fairness is the dress code. How about the fact that women are expected to work in the house all the time? how about the fact that men are allowed to marry multiple women? how about the fact that those women get no say in the matter and the transaction is performed by the parents of the girl and their other family members. There is a lot that is wrong with the social issues of Afghanistan, the mandatory wearing of burkas is just the tip of the iceberg.
DeleteHow does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
ReplyDeleteThe American culture that we live in is perceived as superior in our eyes, so the way we dress, act, and go about our lives is the “correct way.” In American culture women are basically aloud to wear whatever they please, they may get ridiculed for it, but the choice is theirs. When Americans look at the way Afghanistan women dress we assume that it is different or strange, and that it is not the correct way to dress. Yes, some women in those cultures want to be free with what they wear and how they act, but they stay faithful. The practice of veiling may seem like an unusual way for women to dress, but doesn't the way we dress seem strange for people who commonly wear burkas?
An interesting take on the cultural differences between us and Afghanistan I hadn't thought of when I answered this question. I think this may have been because, of the female characters "The Bookseller of Kabul" follows, most of them aren't in favor of Afghani and Islamic traditions that restrict them, such a veiling. This creates something of an image where one might think all Afghani women are against these traditions, rather than just the characters presented in the book. I completely agree with the thought that veiling is still in place because it's accepted as normal.
DeleteWith respect for religious traditions, I wonder how long the practice of veiling will hold out agains the global spread of ideas, like women's rights and gender equality.
DeleteWhere do the characters find sources of inspiration in their lives?
ReplyDeleteSources of inspiration for the characters only come from three sources: Religion, work, and love. The character most inspired by religion is Mansur. After the merchant near the book store offers for him to use a beggar girl, he decides he must purge himself of impure thoughts by taking part in an Islamic New Year ceremony. Although he shortly goes back to his old ways, he is at the very least inspired enough to go through with the ceremony enthusiastically. Other than that, most of the other characters do acknowledge Allah, and their faith in him and what they believe is his plan. Sultan is the only character who finds inspiration through his work. He believes that his bookstore, as well as his book collection, will not only make him successful, but will allow Afghanistan to become a more efficient, intelligent, and modern country. The inspiration of love only effects the women in the book. Women are inspired by thoughts of being able to marry a good man, one who treats them the way they want to be treated, and lets them do what they want. Late into the book, Leila finds inspiration in the letters she gets from Kamir, knowing that he can save her from a life of slaving away for people who don't appreciate her.
Three main things inspire these people... and for some living in this society it's even less than three. The sources of inspiration are ENDLESS in our own culture and many others as well. I often go many days without inspiration and when I read this book and your comment it hits me how fortunate I am for all the sources of inspiration in my life. I imagine some people living in this society have quite a bit of distain for the work they've possibly been forced into doing and the marriages they are forced into as well. Religion for some and many of them is the only source and I think that's something that plays into the radicalism. Religion is literally the only thing some of these people have and they hyper focus on it and war in the name of Allah breaks out.
DeleteI agree that these are the three main sources of inspiration for the characters in this society but not everyone has all three of those things to inspire them. The reason for this is because of the repressive culture they live in which then takes away inspiration too. For example because the women are so repressed in the culture instead of being inspired by religion, work, and love most of these women only are inspired by love and being married.
DeleteHow do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society?
ReplyDeleteFor men in Afghanistan, asserting their individuality is relatively easy. With the only exception being when Afghanistan was controlled by the Taliban, there weren't all that many restrictions on how men can express themselves. In some areas, homosexuality is even considered okay among men. Everyone else, however, has a much more difficult time with expressing themselves. Women and girls are kept from showing themselves in public due to veiling, however they do find ways to express their individuality there. The use of shoes is brought up many times in the book. Shakila, for example, keeps wearing the pumps she got for her wedding after the event, as they're flashy and attention grabbing. Additionally, the book also references the way a woman walks as a way that they can express themselves. Finally, boys are another group that are restricted in their expression. This is because boys are still required to do anything their father asks of them. However, they do have more room for expression. Mansur is abusive to the women in his house, and whenever his dad is gone, he stops doing what he's told.
I was really shocked after reading this book seeing all of the different ways people in this repressive society have to find ways to show their individuality. It is really terrible how men are treated so much more freely than the women and even though the boys are restricted more than the men the women are so restricted at what they can do to show themselves off that they can't tell the husband what his son does when he is gone. I also found it really interesting how the repressed characters would find small holes in the laws of their culture to show themselves off in anyway possible.
DeleteShould there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not?
ReplyDeleteYes, there should be one standard for gender equality in the world. However, I think it's important that it's just that, a standard, rather than a law. The only reason I make that distinction is because it's almost inevitable that there will be examples where men and women are not treated equally, and there will always be men and women who are fine with the roles they're given by these societies. Take Sonya for example. She's perfectly content to be around the house all day, and her only worry in life is that her second child will be another daughter. Granted, women like Sonya (at least within the book) are a minority compared to the women who'd rather have more independence. These societies shouldn't be forced to change their ways by laws, as that would surely bring on violence from those societies. Instead, they could be encouraged by a worldwide standard, allowing them to change on their own terms.
At first I was thrown off by what you said about equality between men and women but once you went on to explain I came to understand and completely agree. There will never be a world wide law enforcing gender equality, there doesn't need to be. Like you said, Sonya herself is content. There are many women like her, in all cultures who are satisfied with their role in society. However, these women may not know of any other life they could live. Irregardless, with so many cultures and view points, even in one country, having a world wide law is too much to bear. Having a world wide standard for equality is as simple and as expected as world wide respect-in my opinion. Some of these women who are content may feel out of place if a law were to be laid upon them and there is no reason for them to feel uncomfortable for doing what they are comfortable with.
DeleteI agree with having one standard for gender equality but how are certain societies going to listen and stop treating genders unequally if it is just a suggesting. I agree that we don't want anymore violence in this world but laws might be the only way we can get societies to be better about gender equality.
DeleteI also agree with having one standard for gender equality throughout the world. I can see what your making an argument towards, some genders may not want this change, so keep it a standard rather than a law. Yet I can't see some places agreeing to just go along with a standard. If gender equality was to be enforced, it would be best to make it a law. This would ensure the equality, instead of making it a general standard people can work around.
DeleteHow do the characters assert their individuality within a repressive society?
ReplyDeleteThere are many ways in which the characters express their individuality, but the women in the book have a much harder time because their faces are for the most part only seen by their family. Bibi Gul expresses herself through eating food. Sultan expresses himself through his business and hard work. Many of the women express themselves through gossip. When they wear the burkas they use their shoes to show their individuality. The men also have requirements to how they should present themselves, like a beard, but can show their faces and at least some skin. They are probably also able to choose from a bigger variety of clothing even if their choices are more limited than what we have in the U.S.
In their repressive society the women have only their voices and thoughts to distinguish them from on another however, the society is so repressive that a great deal of what the women say is ignored. For these women, talking to each other is the only legitimate form of communication. And even then, with some being illiterate and uneducated their conversation is limited to gossip.
DeleteWomen in Afghani society are definitely limited in most, if not all the aspects of their life. Leila's probably the most drastic example of this, spending almost all of her time working around her house. Even in the occasion she does leave, she tends not to go far, and even then requires some form of an escort. I can't imagine what it would feel like to live a life as restrained as that.
DeleteIts interesting to compare family in America to Sultan's family. There is a diamond of command it seems, Sultan at the top, his sons, brothers, his wives, mother, daughters and sisters, and at the very bottom is Leila. Throughout the second part of the book the author elaborates on Leila and how she lives a life similar to that of a slave, simply because she is the youngest girl in the family. Leila compares her life to the dust that she is always trying to sweep away. Her nephew Mansur taunts her and calls her "parasite". It would be considered very rude to call your aunt a parasite in an average American family, mainly because age is more significant than gender. In Leila's case even if she is older and her nephew is younger, his word always goes over hers.
ReplyDeleteIts very interesting how there is a "class" within the family. It reminds me of the caste system in Hinduism. Lelia was born into that low bracket and there is no way to escape it. Only those fortunate enough to be born rich, male or beautiful can succeed in their higher caste.
DeleteHow does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
ReplyDeleteWomen in our country have never really been required to wear headscarves or veil themselves, our culture encourages people to choose what they want to wear. So it is a little strange to peek into different cultures and compare the differences. Veiling is a very foreign thing to the U.S and seeing how it is not commonly practiced, many people associate it with very oppressive and unequal societies. In some cases that isn't quite wrong, but people should keep in mind that many women veil themselves or wear headscarves for religious reasons. Some people go too far, like the Taliban, and place unnecessary restrictions on women to veil themselves. In Leila's case she doesn't like to wear the burka, and tells her friends that when the King returns she will hang it up for good. The author doesn't mention it directly, but implies that the women are frightened to walk the streets by themselves or without a man, let alone without a burka. Many Americans would view that as wrong, but get caught up in the image, and a veil in their mind automatically becomes a symbol for oppression.
Our own culture influenced by the many cultures that come together in our society. Do you think the fact that the society that these characters live in does not have as much mixture of cultures plays a difference into how they themselves view the practice of veiling?
DeleteVeiling one's self should be a personal choice. People who are concerned about oppression should not be worried about muslims who wear hijab or burka. They should be worried about oppressive governments/groups that use fear to control people. That's oppression. A woman wearing an elaborate piece of cloth in a place where you don't isn't an example of oppression, it's an example of a woman observing her right to dress herself according to what is important to her. In fact, telling a woman that her hijab or burka (or any kind of clothing article related to a religion) is a symbol of oppression is an oppressive thing to do. You're essentially telling them that their religions, their practices, their beliefs are wrong. Do not be quick to assume that a person's culture represses them just because it is different from ours.
DeleteAs for what Sadie said, the lack of mixing in their culture definitely plays a role but that's not to say that the introduction of western/atheist would eradicate the muslim practices. Take Dubai for example. They have their roots in Islam but they also have a large population of western people, and westernized local people. In Dubai you can see a pair of women walking in burka next to a woman walking in short shorts and a crop top on the same cross walk. People still keep their beliefs for a variety of reasons and that wouldn't change completely just because of the introduction of western culture.
DeleteHow does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
ReplyDeleteUnited States culture is very encouraging of individualism and personal creation. Many people express themselves through their clothing. The modern society is very fashion forward and progressive in design. U.S culture is also notoriously known for its representation of women. Many argue that we over sexualize the female body. Because of our cultures background with freedom of expression and presentation of women there are mixed messages in U.S culture about veiling. On one hand our culture is accepting of and encourages self expression. On the other hand, when a woman's self expression is through wearing a veil our society criticizes her for not "truly" expressing herself. I have "" around truly because while the society may not thing this woman is truly expressing herself she may feel differently if she has strong beliefs of wearing her veil and if she feels that the veil is expressive of her. This same woman wearing her veil in the U.S may wear it in her own country and feel oppressed because she must wear it by law but she could just as well feel equal as expressed.
The U.S has much variety when it comes to clothing because people have the freedom to wear what they please. I agree with you in how society views women in veils as not expressing themselves enough, many people are ignorant in the religions that they follow or the beliefs that they have.
DeleteI definitely agree with veiling as a way of expressing oneself. When considering the religious reasons behind it and the way it expresses that religion, is it really so different from wearing a crucifix around your neck? As for the mixed messages about veiling, I think the fact that there have been examples of theocratical governments forcing women to veil is the reason behind these mixed messages. I think that when people claim their opposed to veiling, they might actually mean to say they're against it's use as a tool of oppression. The way we can get around this would be to point out the difference between willingly veiling and being forced to veil by someone else.
DeleteHow are the characters affected by events/changes in society?
ReplyDeleteWhen the Taliban reign is over the women live their lives a little lighter at heart.
They can now play music, dance and even paint their toe nails-so long as its hidden under her burka. Leila is "a true child of the civil war, the mullah region and the Taliban." Her character has lived in fear her whole life and cried on the inside for a long time. Because of the Taliban reign she was unable to go to school and she missed out on valuable education. When the Taliban was gone she attended an English course that was a mixed class with boys and girls. In the class she had to remove her burka, an act that made her feel dirty and impure, especially with other boys her age in the room. She was exposed. The Taliban affected Leila, other women and all of their society in negative ways. Once they were gone relief passed over and life resumed is its typical manner however, it was still extremely repressive.
The Taliban managed to leave a lasting effect on the culture. They forced beliefs on a new generation that now wants to follow their rules. She felt dirty in that class because the Taliban taught her to feel dirty in those situations. The new rules after the Taliban left were not actually too oppressive but the Taliban created a generation that wanted to be repressed.
DeleteThe Taliban created a society of fear, where people thought that if they weren't following the old Taliban rules they were wrong or dirty people. They were able to leave a large effect on the culture, that lasted long after the Taliban had left. I think the women were affected more by the Taliban, creating them to feel "dirty" when not wearing the proper clothing. I think it's crazy how the oppression of the Taliban carried over so much into peoples everyday lives, even though they had left.
DeleteGood point, Kyle. The effects of living for decades in a culture of fear, paranoia, and hyper-self-consciousness would permeate one's being. When oppression has been the norm for so long, freedom must be a bit bewildering.
DeleteHow is the practice of veiling (or restrictions on dress in general) reflective of cultural attitudes toward gender roles? How do these attitudes affect characters’ lives?
ReplyDeleteWomen in this culture have far less power than men. Their practice of veiling is one of the many ways that they are distinguished as different. Just like they can't work certain jobs, go to school, or choose their husband. Women who are forced to veil cannot express themselves as freely as men can. When Leila goes to school after the Taliban leaves she has to take her veil off in the class room. She is very uncomfortable with this. The co-ed classroom however, is the first and one of very few places where the boys and girls had some degree of equality. Because this is not the typical practice, a woman being unveiled in public, it disturbs Leila, but it is also her first experience with this kind of equality.
Veiling in the culture is a definite way of showing that women don't have power in the society and all clothing in general shows the power each gender has and how free they can be. I wonder why Leila's school would have her take the veil off if that's not how the public world will be when she grows up? Why is the co-ed classroom giving boys and girls equality if they won't be equal later in life? I think that would just make girls want equality more.
DeleteWe must keep in mind that this is a very different culture from ours. We assume that because they are expected to wear the veil they are unhappy. This applies to some people but there are also plenty of Afghani women who want the veil. Leila, like you said, is uncomfortable without the veil, especially in the company of boys. You could argue that it's because she grew up being told that wearing the veil made her a good muslim but that's beside the point. She seems to enjoy wearing the veil and we shouldn't assume that because she wears it, she feels oppressed and unhappy.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteThe veiling shows just how different men and women are in this culture. It almost hides their personality as well, like everything about that person is under the veil. Yet people are so accustom to this that it ends up disturbing them, and making them feel like they've done wrong when they have to unveil in public. I like the point that Garrett makes. Why are they providing co-ed classrooms and making them equal? If later in life the equality won't be present.
DeleteShould there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not?
ReplyDeleteAfter reading this book and seeing how men and women are treated unfairly in other cultures I believe that there should be one standard of living for everyone throughout the world. This book brought a lot more awareness to how not only women are repressed but also men are repressed in other cultures across the world because of their laws and religion, but the men in these cultures still have the overall power and freedom. There should be one standard of living in the world that is enforced so that women aren't repressed and forced to wear what the men and government in their culture tell them to. With this new standard of living that should be enforced all cultures around the world would have to start treating men and women equally in their culture. This doesn't mean that men and women in these cultures have to be completely free to do what they want but if they are going to repress the women a certain amount then the men should be repressed the same way. Everyone should be equal in their own cultures.
The practice of oppressing women in religion goes back much farther than the country of Afghanistan. It's existed since the beginning of religion. While the government in place in Afghanistan does perpetuate this unfair system, it is not the only problem. The problem is religion's power over people and the ability of women to use religion to control populations of people. The heart of the issue lies in religion, not in Islam or the Afghani government.
DeleteIt would be a big change to some cultures if there were to be a new standard of gender equality around the world. It would mean changing their traditions and their ways of thought. I agree with Cyrus that it is partially a religious problem, and knowing that a lot of people would be unwilling to give up their religions. But all in all it would be nice for people to only think of men and women as equal.
DeleteI agree with Garrett on how there should be a worldwide standard of gender equality, but I do disagree with some of the aspects of this. I've already discussed why I feel an actual enforced law wouldn't be right, so I won't repeat myself on that topic. What actually stood out to me was that if women are oppressed, men should be oppressed equally. I don't think this is the right way to go about equality. I believe equality should always be about bringing the unequal parties, be that religions, races, or genders, up to the same level. So rather than place men under the same restrictions as women, women would simply be freed of their gender-specific restrictions and become equal to men. Additionally, I agree with Cyrus's statement on religion in general being an issue in oppression. To expand on it, it's not even just religion, many societies and governments have some history of oppression, even our own. The challenge in overcoming this oppression is how do you coax a country into loosening their grip on tradition?
DeleteHow is the practice of veiling (or restrictions on dress in general) reflective of cultural attitudes toward gender roles? How do these attitudes affect characters’ lives?
ReplyDeleteThe practice of veiling in this culture shows that women have very little to no power in their society compared to the men who aren't forced to cover their bodies. The women can't choose their husbands or what they wear and once married off the husband has the power to control what his wife can and cannot do. The men can dress how they want and the only thing that represses them is having to follow the cultures religious beliefs and not going against what the government is trying to spread. Women being forced to dress a certain way and cover their body up shows that the women have no say or freedom compared to how the men in the culture can.
I agree the women are very reserved in this society. It's like society expects that they aren't able to think for themselves. The power is just stripped away, and there's really nothing women can do about it. The men are definitely in power in this culture, I wonder if this will ever change?
DeleteI wouldn't say that women are forced to wear what the men say, they can technically wear what they want only under very tight restrictions. The restrictions have been kept in place with violence, and therefore the people being affected are less likely to complain. Also the men weren't quite allowed to wear what they wanted when the Taliban put down their rules, but the rules are certainly less strict when it comes to the men.
DeleteHow does our cultural background shape our perception of women and the practice of veiling (or wearing a head scarf) in other countries?
ReplyDeleteIn America our cultural background has changed our perception on all kinds of different things in other cultures because of stories we hear and see on the news daily. The news shows Americans that people in these other cultures who have religions are bad places because they are usually involved in war because the only news from these cultures is about the wars they are involved in. The news doesn't show us that women in those cultures practice veiling because of their religious beliefs and government laws. So when we see images of women wearing head scarfs in these cultures we don't know their religious reasons for wearing the head scarf and we just relate the head scarfs on these women to the Taliban and other guerrillas who are involved in war in that culture. In the book we end up seeing the truth behind why women have to dress this way and it changes the perceptions we already had made about the cultures across the world.
I agree with you that the media is a very dangerous thing in our culture and tends to leave most of the information out. It is part in part however, some of the women practice veiling because of religious beliefs but I bet some of them would rather wear what they'd like. So in part the media isn't wrong, they only leave out important things and leave people making assumptions.
DeleteNearly everything the people in the book do is inspired by their religion. While not everybody really follows it by the book, and while nobody is truly a core believer at heart, their government is largely based on Islam and the history has been repeatedly sculpted by the religion. Everybody is concerned with being a good muslim and that's why they do many of the things they do.
ReplyDeleteGender equality is a very relevant topic all over the world and third world countries and first world countries alike. There are two problems and both are very related. One is that women and men are simply not the same. Instinctually we have different motivations and perspectives on things. What a woman needs and what a man needs are different things. The other problem is that equal is not always fair. In some cases a woman needs certain things while a man needs other things. For example it can be argued that women deserve slightly higher pay because they are statistically more likely to be taking care of children than a man. Gender fairness is really what should be sought after, not necessarily gender equality. In terms of repressing women by what they wear, that becomes a very tricky issue. To set a global standard on that issue would be essentially creating a dress code for the planet. Whether women are expected to wear more or less there will always be unhappy parties that either want them to wear more or less. If you were to see a woman walking down the street without a top or a bra you'd probably feel the same way a muslim man would feel walking down the streets of Afghanistan seeing a woman wearing shorts and a tee shirt. I think it is impossible to set a standard for equality when it comes to what people wear because then you become just as oppressive as the people forcing women to wear Burka.
ReplyDeleteWhat about setting a standard for equal right to choose what you wear—or don't wear, according to your needs, desires, creed, etc.? Since you mention it, should public nudity be a choice, for men and women?
DeleteI've already said it multiple times in comments but our assumption, because of our culture, is that a woman wearing a head covering is obviously being repressed. While the case can easily be made that Afghanistan has an extremely oppressive culture, we mustn't assume that all people who wear a garment because of their religion are being repressed. Dictating what a person wears without considering the fact that they may want to wear that is making you the oppressor. Remember the fact that not everybody/every culture does things the way you do and consider that when you encounter somebody with a strikingly different culture.
ReplyDeleteMany times people don't get the full story and assume things out of ignorance. Not everyone is the same and I agree with you that it isn't fair for people to judge a whole group of people without first hearing what everyone has to say.
DeleteI would say that our society has started to take a turn for the better in terms of the acceptance of veiling. I don't find that all that surprising, either, just look at the project we're doing now with these books, literally called "Behind the Veils". Of course, our society isn't going to change its opinions overnight, or even over the course of months and years, and there'll be some people who refuse to see things from another perspective. However, there's nothing stopping us from trying to spread acceptance, and calling out oppression and intolerance when we see it.
DeleteShould there be one standard for gender equality throughout the world? Why or why not?
ReplyDeleteAfter reading this book and noticing how men and women are treated unreasonably I believe that there should be one standard for gender equality throughout the world. This book showed how each of the genders were repressed to specific levels, as women had many more rules, but men were repressed as well. Men were presented with freedom that the women didn’t have, but were still forced to wear “correct clothing” and follow their religion. People should not be told how to act, or what to wear. There are limitations to actions like harming other humans, but why should people be restricted on what they want to where or what religion to follow. Gender equality has always been off in every culture, but we as people have evolved and gender quality should evolve with us. It shouldn't be fair to tell a women to wear something repressive, when the opposing gender doesn't have to.
How do the characters’ personal stories expand your understanding of the societies in which they live?
ReplyDeleteThe personal stories of characters sometimes provide the reader with a little story of their own. When you follow characters throughout this story, you learn more what it would be like to be in their situation. The personal story of Sultan shows that even though people are restricted a great living can still be made. The personal story of a character provides more background information of the topic rather than just the overview details. The repressive qualities are able to be seen more vividly through the eyes of Sharifa than an overview would be. Personal stories allow the reader to learn more detail about the subject at hand.
I agree that the use of a changing perspective in the book allowed for better insight into Afghan society. While in all honesty, I don't think this translated well into a compelling overall story, (For example, Leila's romance near the end of the book is almost exactly the same as a previous story, save for the outcome of the romances.) it was valuable in what it brought to the table in terms of educational value.
DeleteHow are the characters affected by events/changes in society?
ReplyDeleteThe Taliban ruling changed the life of modern Afghanistan society, even though the Taliban are no longer in power their rules rubbed off on the people in the society. The repressiveness of the Taliban made women within the culture question their new ways, even though they were thrilled about the Taliban leaving. Leila a girl who longs to be a teacher grew up during the rule of the Taliban, and during that she was not allowed to attend school. When the Taliban left she attended school, but felt out of place. Leila grew up as virtual household slave who suffers from dizzy spells because she never sees the sunlight. The Taliban left and she still didn't feel like she belonged, a lot of the repressive ways stayed even though people strictly enforcing them left.